Polly Mertens: 0:25

hey, superstars welcome back polly here, sam pruitt, what’s up?

Polly Mertens: 0:29

beautiful humans hey you guys, we’ve got a fun topic today. Samantha and I are our usual fired up, but I think we’re in a fun phase and pretty fired up about this one we’re calling this one. Should I break up with my coach?

Polly Mertens: 0:41

Should I break up with my coach? It’s like a reality TV show.

Polly Mertens: 0:48

Oh, that is kind of a topic for that is kind of a name for it. We should get on that show. We, you know, we should help people. Oh, yes, we should be hosting that show and how. So what I want to start us off with is you know, some people I’m hoping if you’re, you’ve clicked on this and you’re listening to this it’s like probably in a coaching relationship you’re like maybe it’s not working or whatever, and that’s what we’re here to share with you is you know what is coaching, what’s unhealthy coaching? So start us off with like, what is a good coach? Or what is coaching, if you will, and maybe some qualities to look for in a good coach.

Samantha Pruitt: 1:22

Yeah, and before I do that, because I want people to really listen to that definition I’m about to spout. It’s my definition. By the way, it’s not from online AI or thesaurus, but so take it with a grain of salt. But you and I are coaches, so if they haven’t figured that piece out, you know we’re life and business coaches.

Samantha Pruitt: 1:43

Also, I have been an athletic coach, an endurance sports coach, a running coach, a triathlon coach, personal trainer, all those things. So we have this sort of when we say coaching, we do mean like an all encompassing sort of umbrella. You can apply this conversation we’re going to have to any type of coaching. This conversation we’re going to have to any type of coaching. Okay, in my two cents a coach helps you take inventory of your life, supports the process of identifying what is working and what is not working and the opportunities for change and growth that may be hiding. They collaborate with you while you unpack your truth and explore your potential.

Samantha Pruitt: 2:32

A coach sees, hears and feels your story, your experience. A coach believes in you. A coach is on a mission to help you remove well. A good coach. A good coach is on a mission to help you remove Well. A good coach. A good coach is on a mission to help you remove the layers of your life that are no longer serving you, so that you can redirect your time, your energy, your resources, your focus to building the life you really want and deserve.

Polly Mertens: 2:59

Hmm, wow, that’s you know I hadn’t thought of this until you just read that again. Like I was really taking it in the the coach. I was like, oh yeah, it was like hitting, it was landing with me, like oh yeah, that’s nice is I mean? It’s obvious that it’s a relationship. It’s two people the coach and the coachee if you will.

Polly Mertens: 3:17

But I was like, wow, it’s a little bit like when you’re evaluating a partner, a life partner, right, you, you, you have criteria or things that are meaningful to you, or what do you expect from this, let’s say relationship, and know when it’s like healthier, when there’s good qualities in that person. And when you were saying this, I was like, yeah, and a coach is a it’s a very intimate relationship at times, right, I mean, you’re oftentimes sharing a lot of deep things with this person. So I mean, you know we’re going to go into like healthy and unhealthy coaching and whatnot. But it’s like, just as you would choose to step into a relationship with an intimate partner and you think about that and what would serve you and what are you looking for in that person I think there’s a list like that, like you just were talking about. Like what, what do you want to look for in a good coach?

Samantha Pruitt: 4:07

Yeah, exactly, and maybe we’ll put that up in some other format somewhere for people to have, you know, like a deeper consideration for themselves and with themselves, because it’s an internal conversation. Every human is incredibly unique, right? So when I share these things, I want the individual listening to really give reflection on their personal needs, wants, wishes and values while looking to identify this coach.

Polly Mertens: 4:35

And I think we need to like get on the table. Both of us. We’ve both been in a coachy role in the last month or more. You for a few months, right, you’re doing your Ironman training and you’ve had what we thought was a coach, and maybe there’s a little dynamic that we want to share about that. And I also hired a coach recently to help me in my journey through studying and understanding myself through human design. So we were kind of fired up because we’re both going. This isn’t serving me Right. So do you want to share a little bit of what you know? Seeing that you know and that’s been for you, has brought up for you about why we wanted to talk about this, like, why did we think this was important? Is what I want to say.

Samantha Pruitt: 5:18

Well, I’ll tell you, I’ve been thinking about this for a long time because I have been in a coaching role and been coached, so I do choose to be on both sides of the table Coaches get coaches.

Samantha Pruitt: 5:34

Many times. Yeah, good coaches get coaches because they understand the value and they have, you know, even a next level skill set, if you will, to really get a lot out of those relationships. So, whether it is health and wellness and fitness, which is how I started in the coaching arena, but then I moved into this much deeper dive, you know, with other aspects of my skill set and needs with humans. So I personally have experienced I will share the story of this recent one, but many times these really great or not so great experiences. So I do think sharing that is important for our audience and being us, being transparent and candid. So I appreciate you kind of throwing that right out of the gate.

Samantha Pruitt: 6:18

So recently, yes, I’m training for my Iron Woman 2.0 adventure this fall, right, so I’m all in on this really significant goal for myself. It’s a physical challenge, obviously, but it also does require a lot of mental training. So it’s a big, audacious goal. I want to go faster than I went 13 years ago. I’m now 55, postmenopausal, so it’s the game has changed, things have changed and I’m incredibly committed to this goal. So my idea was, with the intention of finding a coach, get somebody that can maybe help me navigate things a little differently than I would have done way back in the day, and I was a triathlon coach coaching other athletes and had a triathlon club. So I have the background, yeah.

Polly Mertens: 7:04

So you can build a plan and, yeah, you know what needs to get done.

Samantha Pruitt: 7:07

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure, Totally so. But when you’re trying to take something you’ve done and next level it, it really is helpful to have this collaborative relationship where you can really maybe explore another level of yourself as an athlete or as a human being, you know. So that’s what was my intention of this latest commitment to hiring a coach, which I did, and there were some parts of the relationship that were going well, which was mostly around programming, you know, and actual workouts and things of that nature.

Polly Mertens: 7:44

Training plan.

Samantha Pruitt: 7:45

Yeah, training plan, yeah, but there was this massive piece to the relationship that wasn’t working and it had to do with communication styles. It had to do with, you know, ideas around mindset. It had to do with ideas about empowerment, things that I feel so passionately about. So I’m sure I maybe am not the average client, but I want to be and I’m willing and empowering our audience to become that person too right, like to know yourself very well and to understand what your needs are so that you can communicate those.

Polly Mertens: 8:21

So, anyway, the wheels fell off the bus in my particular relationship with this person and I did break up with my coach last week, so that’s why this is hot topic for us this week and it goes to you you and I both listened to different episodes of different people’s podcasts and what we were hearing from high performance coaches in, let’s say, the Olympics or world-class cycling or whatever it was is and you and I know this right from our own world of coaching other people, but also in our own dynamic of pursuing high performance athletics is it’s not just the training plan that’s going to get you to the finish line.

Samantha Pruitt: 8:55

It is your performance bubble or your performance team or we call it the A team, and we have a whole series of episodes on the A team. Like it’s surrounding yourself with the right people in the right environment that curates the space that really allows you to perform at your highest level physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, in business, et cetera. Like it’s the whole package, right? Sometimes there can be one coach, sometimes there can be a bunch of coaches, but that was, you know, a recent issue. Basically that became a challenge for me and I was trying to navigate it gracefully and, you know, come to terms with creating a relationship that could work for me and so forth. It did not at the end of the day and I had open communication and was very transparent about, you know, my experience and very professional about it. It’s not the right fit, but there are instances where I’ve also had that, where I was the coach and I was coaching somebody else.

Samantha Pruitt: 9:56

So sometimes it’s just not the right fit Right, and I think we also want to open the doorway of the conversation for that too, for people to be thinking that. Well, I was saying coaches are not gurus. Right, they will get into what’s healthy and unhealthy and in a coaching dynamic, but it’s really imperative for people to understand that they have a choice. It’s probably the number one takeaway from this is that you have a choice and the fact that you are so committed to yourself, your personal development, your growth, your journey, your path, that you would invest in a coach the resources, time, money, energy, connectivity, all of the things into you know, building that opportunity with another human being to me is an incredible gift you give yourself and it needs to be respected and handled appropriately on both sides of the table.

Samantha Pruitt: 10:56

Anyway, that was a little bit of a rant, but I love it.

Polly Mertens: 10:58

No, no, that’s what we’re talking about is, you know, it’s all things around, this coaching dynamic, this relationship between these usually two humans sometimes it’s coach on a team or something, but let’s say it’s two humans and when the wheels can go off the bus, like like it does, either lack of, you know, just like in an intimate relationship, yeah, misalignment of values, misalignment of interests, or lack of trust, trust personality, personality, right, and then things can go like, oh, the dynamics of communication between the two people aren’t workable, or they’ve got trump, one’s got trump, and you know, whatever. So it’s like these dynamics are fluid and it’s the coming together of those two people and is it workable or not? Right and um, the only other thing I wanted to insert before we get into and I love the idea of like what is healthy and what is unhealthy is, um, what I’m finding with a coach that I’ve been working with, is noticing the distinction between coaching and what I’m just going to refer to as subject matter expertise, because I think there’s a big difference that I’m seeing that I hadn’t seen before, which is hiring someone. So I love to pay people, professionals, to get further, faster, farther, you know. So I’m like, oh, if I can pay this person a few hundred dollars, a few thousand dollars and make a leap, that’s a good investment, like I’m, like I’m buying the time, I’m buying their experience to shorten my path of.

Polly Mertens: 12:20

I got to figure this out, I got to learn, you know, whatever we can get there, but this person can help me get there further, faster, farther, and so in this case, what I’ve noticed is I thought I was hiring more of a coach to help me work with, you know, this human design in alignment with some things that I was wanting to see for myself. And what I got or I’m realizing is three sessions in, is it’s more just subject matter expert? And I’m still doing, you know, I’m still being my own coach and I was like that wasn’t what I, that’s what it wasn’t what I was looking for, and that’s okay, right. So I just want to point out like sometimes you can find yourself with, oh, this person has a lot of knowledge, but they’re not a great coach, like they can.

Polly Mertens: 12:59

Just, you know, it’s kind of like here’s what you need to do. Like I think that was a little bit of what was going, a little bit of what was going on in your dynamic. She’s like here’s a training plan, just do this, you’ll be fine. And you and I are like, yeah, and we’re not. You know, we’re not just the average Joe like you know, or Jill, we want, we want the performance.

Samantha Pruitt: 13:25

We want. Well, and I would say what, when you’re sharing your story, what I was taking in and processing in my own wheels over here, my own hamster cage, was the difference between, like a consultant, or a expert in a industry and topic versus a coach.

Samantha Pruitt: 13:37

Yeah, and we’ve been in consultant roles too and we’ve had consultants, we’ve worked with them. So, like you do get those experts in the space in their knowledge but there’s no other skillset generally that comes to the table or is even in the room because it’s just not what was meant to happen there. And then, with my dynamic, just when you were saying, that too kind of triggered for me, kind of triggered for me. I definitely think that sometimes people who are coaching and who feel they are the expert in the topic, subject matter, process or whatever, still need to have the skills, by the way, to meet the person where they’re at, communicate appropriately, listen, see and hear the other individual so it can become really powerful. Like the amount of work that can be done is mind blowing. We know we’ve done those things, but that’s so amazing, rather than that guru model or that expert model of like it’s my way or the highway you better, you know, check in with me with all these people get into unhealthy and healthy. But that’s interesting how you were.

Polly Mertens: 14:51

And so and I love you know this back and forth. I’m totally digging because, as you were saying that, I was like, oh, my God, and back to that you know, intimate partner relationship thing. It’s, you know, the person that’s looking for someone to rescue them. Right, like, oh, when this person comes into my life, my life will be complete or solved, or something like that. Right, and so going and I think you and I are not that coach, we’re not here, you know we’re.

Polly Mertens: 15:16

You know it’s not like, oh, we’re going to solve all your problems, whatever. It’s like no, we’re going to help you do the work, You’re going to do the push-ups, you’re going to do the reps, you’re going to do the homework, you’re going to do the hard conversations, whatever. That is saying no boundaries, whatever you need to do. But it’s not going to someone and then putting all the power in that person and they’re relationship. You don’t go to your spouse, your boyfriend, your girlfriend and it’s like, oh, once we’re together, my life is complete. Oh, right, now that’s part of the dysfunction giving up your power and we’re going to get into that, okay.

Samantha Pruitt: 15:54

So let’s get into that. Yeah, let’s get into it. Oh, my goodness. Well, I’ll list off some things and then you jump in either share an experience where you had this, or maybe you’ve got something else to add, so let’s just get started. So, under the healthy bucket, a coach empowers you to build self-knowledge and confidence, versus in an unhealthy, they encourage you to give up your power and your autonomy. Give it up to them, obviously, right, so it really one is an empowered individual taking charge of their life and really discovering so much about themselves.

Polly Mertens: 16:32

Yeah.

Samantha Pruitt: 16:33

And it’s amazing. And the other is the person is kind of robbing you of that opportunity really and being the ultimate authority and taking power away from you, disempowering you.

Polly Mertens: 16:45

Ugly, ugly, ugly.

Samantha Pruitt: 16:46

Yeah, I know, but it happens. We’re both have experienced it many times and, yeah, we’ve seen it.

Polly Mertens: 16:53

Okay, so that’s one I was thinking of. So I was, you know, when I was in high school I had a. So it was big volleyball, loved volleyball through high school, college and beyond, and I had my first year in high school. I had a. So I was big volleyball, loved volleyball through high school, college and beyond, and I had my first year in high school. Volleyball was a so-so coach. You know kind of probably hired from the local community. You know just kind of getting it done. If you will, then next year, you know lineup, you know showing up to the gym and I’m like, okay, great tryouts or whatever in walks in a former olympic, oh damn volleyball player, just hell yes. And I was like, oh shit, what do we have here? Okay, thanks, you know, new sheriff in town, kind of feeling instantly right, totally, totally.

Polly Mertens: 17:34

And I mean she was lean, I bet such a compassionate badass like like, like, so good, you’re going to, you’re going to fucking do work, but you’re going to love it and you’re going to be pushed in a beautiful way like to bring out the best in you. Not, you know, like you’re, you’re a peon. You don’t know what you’re doing. You know it was never like hard work for the sake of it. It was like hard work to build you into your best. So I mean to take, it was like hard work to build you into your best. So I mean we won championship, like it was amazing.

Polly Mertens: 18:11

So, but yeah, I love it, love it, love it. And it was like you said it was. It was, it was the. It wasn’t taking our power away and it, right, it was dictatorial in a good, healthy, dynamic way, right like she knew the, the reps that we needed to do, the things that we needed to do and the standard that we needed to have right. So, anyway, that we needed to do and the standard that we needed to have Right. So, anyway, that just jumped in my head when you said any stories.

Polly Mertens: 18:27

So all right, get me with some more healthy coaching.

Samantha Pruitt: 18:30

Unhealthy Internal validation so you learn to internally validate yourself versus external validation and approval versus external validation, and approval.

Polly Mertens: 18:42

Well, and that’s a little bit what we’re talking about, like that relationship where you turn over your power to your spouse or your boyfriend oh yeah, the save me kind of mentality, or oh, this coach knows more than me, I’ll just do whatever they say and instead it’s like oh, they’re like diving into you, showing up more for who you are, or finding whatever feels weak and helping you strengthen it right yeah, when you have to reach outside of yourself to understand your greatness.

Samantha Pruitt: 19:13

An example is like in show you know sports for children. You do see this, I’m a parent, I’m a grandparent also. The kids playing the sport and they score, they do whatever, and then they immediately look. Make sure the parents are looking. Give them this feedback that has been developed. This feedback loop has been developed. Right, it’s conditioned yeah, yeah, I good, am I good? Did I do a good thing? Like versus the athlete or the human at work or wherever being? Like check me out, knowing within themselves and with their own communication that they’re crushing it, that they’re doing?

Polly Mertens: 19:58

yeah I love that I love it, I it, so keep us going on this role. So what else is healthy and unhealthy? What else you got?

Samantha Pruitt: 20:07

Um, I autonomy we mentioned, versus relying on the coach for advice and constant direction, like that feedback loop, again like, hey, am I doing this right? You know, uh, making choices. So when I talk about autonomy specifically, I’ll give a couple of examples about this. Um, in an athletic performance, training for an event or whatever that might be going, uh, looking like you know, trying to reach performance goals physically, there’s a training program, you follow it. You don’t generally follow it to a T, okay, even at the Olympic level, the world-class level, you don’t why.

Samantha Pruitt: 20:44

Because we are humans, your body, physiologically, is always changing. The environment’s changing conditions are, everything is changing, it’s dynamic. So those programs and that coaching needs to be dynamic. That’s why communication is so critical, et cetera. You know feedback in in different methodologies.

Samantha Pruitt: 21:04

So having autonomy would be the athlete, like myself, for example okay, I’m going to go, I need to do a 70 mile ride, it’s 110 degrees. It is ill-advised for me to go out for five hours and ride my bike in 110 degree weather with the knowledge knowing that that whole week I still have 15 hours of training to do. I have all these other things going on right, so I would be burying myself. I can make an intelligent decision about that, modify that day and then communicate that back to my coach, or even, in advance, communicate that back and there’d be a conversation, and then you’d modify the training program and you’d adapt, and then you’d do it differently Nimble, flexible, versus if you’ve given up your power in an unhealthy environment and, yes, I have definitely seen this many, many times the coach says this is the workout, you will do it, irrelevant of the conditions, irrelevant of the fact you didn’t sleep last night, irrelevant of the fact that you’re totally stressed out in your home life, blah, blah, blah, blah, on and on.

Samantha Pruitt: 22:14

You will do the work. Ridiculous, yeah, ridiculous.

Samantha Pruitt: 22:20

Finally, following orders so you’ve got to have a relationship where that autonomy is curated, appreciated, elevated, like I want my people, whether it’s my business clients or my health and fitness clients to feel like they know themselves better than I do. And if they give me that information and they communicate and we have that kind of relationship, I can help, be of service to really maximize their experience.

Polly Mertens: 22:50

And I want to add to what you’re saying and I can’t remember if you have this to come so if.

Polly Mertens: 22:57

I’m dropping something. So I was doing a facilitated strategy session this morning with you know, the CEO, coo of a company, right? And when you talk about autonomy, so I’m not there to say, hey, hey guys, you know this is your business, but but I know better than you Like this is what you need to do, right? That’s not how I show up at the table. It’s like I am.

Polly Mertens: 23:21

I feel full trust that they have beautiful brains, beautiful connections to their own path and their future and all this stuff. Maybe they need some you know, guardrails or some feedback, right, or what about that, or some. But it’s usually a curiosity, a questioning that allows them, like you said, to autonomously go inside and know what’s right for them, right? So, even with so, sometimes, you know, I get it like a training plan for, like when I was doing my Ironman, a lot of this was I was out on the web trying to find I didn’t hire a coach. You know I had you, thank you, and we were like coach and but I would like throw some things around. But you know, say in business, I’m sorry, but there’s no training plan, for oftentimes there’s no training plan.

Samantha Pruitt: 24:01

You can just get off the web you can’t just go.

Polly Mertens: 24:03

Hey, give me a 16 week, build my business in a box. You know you can get some information, whatever, but the autonomy is knowing inside, like what’s the next next step or is this? Should I do this or should I do this? And I think you know us as coaches. What we look at is, you know, and the coach that’s right for you is empowering you to help you decide, asking you the questions. That pulls out your knowing and guess what, as with children, you think that this is the best decision. Hey, go ahead and try that.

Samantha Pruitt: 24:33

Exactly, go out and try that.

Polly Mertens: 24:36

Yeah, See if that works for you right, Whether it’s training and physical, like you said. Oh yeah, I know.

Samantha Pruitt: 24:41

And then bring you me your honest feedback, by the way because, I know coaching relationships where the person being coach is hiding information from the coach that is critical to the actual strategy goal, et cetera. But they don’t feel like they can impart strategy goal et cetera. But they don’t feel like they can impart all of the information. Or they feel like I should come to the coach and I should already have the answers, because I don’t want to be seen as stupid, incapable this and that. Right, they’ve done this whole mind game on themselves and they disempowered themselves to even be fully present and real in the relationship. What is the purpose of this, then? Why are we even doing this?

Polly Mertens: 25:29

Well, I think this is a little tangent. That I think we should go down is because I think you and I have been around enough empowered coaches and our style is what we’re talking about and we need to point out like, well, you know you’ll talk about more of this in the unhealthy, but it’s like when people don’t feel like they can be honest or forthright in their coaching relationship or share vulnerable things or not have a win to bring back to the coach that week and because of fear, or you know, not know the answer and be afraid to show up, so maybe they start postponing or they procrastinate or, like you said, or they you know all this like shenanigans that go on.

Polly Mertens: 26:01

it’s like that’s a red flag, that’s like being in, like we talked about an intimate relationship and you start not telling this person what you’re doing and like oh, because they’re not going to like me anymore or they won’t find that attractive in me anymore, whatever if that person doesn’t see you like. You believe, believe in you, adore you all flaws and all, or you know in this coaching relationship. Like you tried something, it didn’t work. Okay, let’s try something else. Like what else?

Samantha Pruitt: 26:29

What’s next, Darling? I’ve been coaching a business, one particular business, for over five years through so many iterations of entrepreneurship. Iterations of entrepreneurship, different endeavors, evolutions, like so many things. A couple people and then a particular team and a couple businesses, and it has been fascinating. What a journey, what a fricking ride and a privilege that I’ve been on it. But I have seen, so I know these people, the leadership individuals on this team, more intimately than their spouses do in some cases, because of the depth and the longevity of the experience together, and so you know they’re just perfectly imperfect humans, just like me. Are you hearing me? Did?

Polly Mertens: 27:16

I just go mute, or.

Samantha Pruitt: 27:18

No, I can hear you. I can hear you. Can you hear me?

Polly Mertens: 27:22

I can’t hear you.

Samantha Pruitt: 27:23

Really Say something.

Polly Mertens: 27:25

Maybe it’s just me.

Samantha Pruitt: 27:28

Can you hear me now? Can you hear me now?

Polly Mertens: 27:31

Oh, yep, I don’t know what to say. Maybe it was me. My thing just started to say your internet connection is unstable, so you were saying about, so I can cut this out. But you were saying I know these people intimately about, so I can cut this out, but you were saying I know these people intimately.

Samantha Pruitt: 27:50

Yeah, so I have an experience of five years of working with a particular team business client of mine and through so many iterations of their business model and their different businesses and their teams, et cetera, et cetera, and it’s been a hell of a ride, honestly.

Samantha Pruitt: 28:01

But in saying that, the reason I wanted to point that out is like there are humans and life is complicated, right so I really want them to be their most true, authentic selves with me, and sometimes that’s pretty crazy, especially over a lifetime experience. You know every family, you name it but if I can really be of service and create this space where they can navigate through and ultimately reach their goals which is why you hire a coach generally, you have goals you need to be able to navigate that messiness and allow them to be who they are and not judge it, not take it personally, you know, not let it get out of hand. Also, because that can get out of hand. You need to have boundaries in these situations them with me and me with them, right. But just in saying that, I just think it’s so important that people really realize that it can be complex and if you don’t feel you can really be yourself in this relationship. It’s not going to work. It’s not going to work.

Polly Mertens: 29:14

Yeah, because if you want the best out of yourself and the best out of why you hired this person and there’s not that, there’s things that constrain it, whether it’s I don’t try, I don’t feel comfortable with them, or I can’t count on them for this, or they wouldn’t understand, or whatever the story is, check in with yourself. Is that true? Like, maybe this coach can does have capacity, maybe this coach can, you know, see you unconditionally, not judging or whatnot, and that’s for you to a little bit overcome, right? Like, oh, I just need to open up more and share more in order to receive more out of this relationship. Or have you tried and it was shut down? Or you felt the judgment, or you felt the lack of, you know, harmony and health, like you said, of you know being empowered, being seen and heard for what you are, with some boundaries, right? Then, yeah, it might not be the right scenario for you. Okay, let’s hear it. Are there any more of you.

Samantha Pruitt: 30:09

Yeah, so in some coaching instances not just in physical performance, but in business, for sure, a lot of times the coaches and maybe this is more subject matter, expert, kind of consulting, not coaching they focus on the metrics, the analytics, the data of what is happening with the goal, the person or the team or whatever. Right, and not really. Either they’re not comfortable navigating the deeper conversation, the deeper conversation, the human behind the data, or they just simply don’t know how. And so I’m not saying that those coaches are invaluable, but those are different types of people, right. Those are analysis, expert performance, you know different things, that they’re bringing the data and the analytics to the table. It’s important to have that too, but that’s not who we are as humans. We’re not just our numbers. If somebody was coaching in an athletic program and just looking at the data, it would be so incredibly human.

Samantha Pruitt: 31:17

Yeah, exactly, you wouldn’t be able to even understand what’s going on and why the data is the way it is, and same in business, whether they’re crushing their sales goals or absolutely tanking. That’s happening for a reason. The reason is the human beings behind the activity right, I was just thinking.

Polly Mertens: 31:39

It’s like going to a Western medicine doctor and this is showing my prejudice here going to a Western medicine doctor and they get some lab results, they treat the symptoms, versus going to another alternative medicine field, whatever, healer, whatever, and they not only take a holistic approach, but they know that the symptoms are not what’s causing the symptoms.

Samantha Pruitt: 32:01

Or, even worse, they say your blood works normal and you say well, I feel horrible, which I have autoimmune. I’ve been through menopausal many times. I’ve been like I don’t care how normal that is. I feel miserable, do you? Hello, yeah, and they’re like no, you’re good.

Polly Mertens: 32:20

Go home. Yeah, yeah, see you next year. Thanks, exactly, yeah. So those people you definitely want to fire definitely want to break up with that relationship, because we all want to feel good, we want the results that we want. If we’re not happy with what’s showing up or how it’s going, then, yeah, step out of it. Okay, so, any more, any more.

Samantha Pruitt: 32:40

Oh no, but I do have some questions at the end that I want the audience to reflect on, but we’ll save that to the end.

Polly Mertens: 32:47

Okay, so let’s share some what to do, Like okay. So maybe after hearing this, you’re like, damn, I don’t feel like I’m in the right relationship. You know as we. You know, I don’t know that it’s me or my coach or whatever, but it’s not working. Something’s not working, Dear John. No, I’m sorry, Dear Jill.

Samantha Pruitt: 33:07

Write the letter, dear Jill.

Polly Mertens: 33:09

So what would you suggest as like steps, or how would they go about, like what are their options, like what do we do?

Samantha Pruitt: 33:16

So, from both sides of the table, whether you’re being coached or the coach. So we have these experiences on both sides. As a coach, what would I appreciate? And as the person being coached, what do I feel is appropriate? And they’re the same right. So the number one is respectful communication. So, if things aren’t going well, you’re not feeling it, for whatever reason, the first thing you need to do is have an actual conversation. This is not a text. This is not a text. This is not a DM. This is not a note inside some piece of data or some program that you’re using to communicate and track metrics. Right, this is not an email. This is a real, actual conversation.

Polly Mertens: 34:00

And the request for that could be a text, an email or whatever, but then the conversation is human-to-human voice oh yeah, that’s it. We still do that. We still do real life. Yes, yeah, and I think in the context of that, it’s asking for what you need, I think, is the most important right, and hopefully you’ve done an inventory of what you need or what’s not working, you know, or at least perhaps, in the interest of collaboration, you could say well, this is what I’m experiencing out of this, I was hoping for this and this is what I feel like I’m getting. Um, you know, maybe it’s a. What do you see is causing this breakdown? You know, and then I can start a dialogue. You know it’s like, oh, this is what I was saying, and then you can start a dialogue. You know it’s like, oh, this is what I was saying, and then you open it up. How are you feeling about the relationship?

Samantha Pruitt: 34:47

You know, just like you would in, yes, Many times, you will find that these two individuals again, unique individuals have completely different ideas about what the expectations and the goals were of this relationship, and maybe they were conveyed in the beginning and there’s been a breakdown. Maybe they were never conveyed, maybe they were conveyed but not really heard or were perceived as different, right. So just giving each other grace to be like, hey, actually, these are the things I was looking for and I’m still looking for, or maybe you’re. What you’re looking for is change, that’s all fine, right. So communicating all of that and being really honest about it and with grace, like I said, not in a rude, you know, combative way.

Samantha Pruitt: 35:32

Throwing blame? Yeah, no, throwing blame?

Polly Mertens: 35:34

Not at all.

Samantha Pruitt: 35:35

Yeah, and then making sure that this dialogue because it’s a two-way street, you know the person is being heard and these issues are going to be resolved and addressed. So what’s the strategy around that? Or there could be just that hard, honest conversation of that’s not what I do, Like you have an example of. This person is an expert in this thing and that’s what they do. They’re staying in their lane and you’ve been in their lane with them, but you actually want to be in a different lane doing it differently. There’s no shame, no blame. There’s nothing about this that needs to turn negative at all. Right, it’s just like, oh, we just didn’t make the right fit with one another. So hopefully, that’s kind of what happens.

Samantha Pruitt: 36:24

Now I’ll tell you based on my own personal experience, it usually doesn’t go like that. I mean, you know, several times you will see that it might go off the rails and I think, just to be honest about that, people come to these conversations um, ramped up. Maybe they’re not in the right frame of mind, Maybe, you know, they’re having a hard day, there’s other things going on in their life and they bring that baggage with them to this conversation. So we do want to really encourage people to come in with the right energy, prepared for the conversation to keep it calm, cool and collected and all that kind of stuff and honest you know, yeah, yeah, and sometimes you just know that it’s not working.

Polly Mertens: 37:01

You know, you just know, so you don’t? You know, if you feel, you know, trust, your intuition is this uh, you know, I think we just need to talk about a couple of things and I think we could work through this, or I think I could. You know, I think this relationship could be more valuable for both of us.

Samantha Pruitt: 37:15

If you know, we, whatever you know, whatever it is for you, and so if you decide to keep going though let’s say that they do there should be some guidelines agreed upon by both parties, right? So what could that look like? We’re going to try this again, polly. What could this look like? How should we do this? Yeah?

Polly Mertens: 37:34

exactly. And then you just speak your needs. Right, you speak your needs, each direction you know, seen, heard, okay, agreed upon, great. And then out of that conversation conversation might be like I, one of you maybe decides it’s not a new agreement, there’s not workability for whatever reason, right, like I think you had this in your case. You’re like well, I would really like you know a step into this realm, these other things and you know, this is what I was like, and it was like nope, you’re like, okay, then I think we’re done here.

Samantha Pruitt: 38:03

Okay, peace, peace out, see you later I was like full respect, Just giving me a hard no is better than a let’s wait and see and drag this on for a long time. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Polly Mertens: 38:15

No, I mean, this is your life.

Samantha Pruitt: 38:19

This is your life yeah, time, money, energy, yeah, so much. And you know we are all about empowering people on all sides, you know, to do what’s right for them.

Polly Mertens: 38:32

Yeah so if your coach has got to go. She’s, he’s got to go. You know it’s like, okay, we’re breaking up here, that’s all good, it’s all good Next. So what are some of the questions? You had some advice on things to be thinking about or asking them.

Samantha Pruitt: 38:46

So let’s say you’re just trying to determine if this coach is right for you. So maybe it’s not going poorly but it’s not going great, or maybe you want to open up a conversation with them. You know, maybe you newly have acquired this coach in whatever capacity, or it’s been going for a while, maybe it’s gotten a little bit stale. So these are questions I’d like to prompt for the audience, for them to do a little bit of reflection. First question do I trust this individual with my wellbeing Period? Yeah, and stop. So. It isn’t. Do I trust him with my business or with my training program or with my, whatever I’ve hired this person to do my relationship, my wellbeing? Yeah, and do not.

Polly Mertens: 39:39

They will impact it and don’t lie to yourself. Be true about this, don’t be the like oh well, I really like this coach, you know. It’s like it’s your freaking life, it’s your wellbeing, like, if there. If you don’t answer that with a oh yeah, hell, yes, yeah, then like that’s for you and and I think, gosh, if that’s a maybe, I don’t think you have the right coach?

Samantha Pruitt: 40:04

I don’t think you have the right coach not good enough, yeah, not good enough, yeah, yeah, all right, all right what number two does this coaching relationship shrink or expand me?

Samantha Pruitt: 40:15

yeah, yeah, I mean, I don’t know about you, but I’m big on expansion. Actually I do know that about you, paul, but I’m big on expansion Actually I do know that about you, polly. But speaking to the audience like we are here to evolve and expand, and if that relationship makes you shrink when you go to the room, the phone call, the exchange, the whatever happens here, if you are shrinking either in their presence or in their communication, that is not the right coach.

Polly Mertens: 40:47

You know, what I just got is like thinking about that intimate relationship, because I’ve seen myself in this dynamic before. I want to call it like so. In intimate relationship we’ll say like narcissistic, and that’s just a word that’s thrown around, but I’m kind of hearing like bully, right? So if you feel like your coach is a bully and you like right.

Samantha Pruitt: 41:08

Oh girl.

Polly Mertens: 41:09

Have I seen that?

Samantha Pruitt: 41:11

Right, I’ve seen that, and I’ve seen it in a lot in sports performance, but I’ve actually seen it in the business arena too, and that’s incredibly unfortunate. That’s a hell, hell no.

Polly Mertens: 41:23

So if you feel like you’re being bullied or it’s got this like oh, playground, yucky feeling, it’s like oh, I don’t you know. Uh-uh, like goodbye, that don’t, don’t even keep another day of that, like no, you deserve to be with somebody who. I mean, just they like I feel like when I have you know that coach I was talking about with the volleyball and Olympic I felt like a radiant, amazing, like you know. I mean, she was hard. You know she’s like run your damn laps, do you? You know like she made us do the drills and stuff, but man, did I feel expanded?

Polly Mertens: 41:59

knowing her being in her team, being like our team, was just like lifted up right, it was never. Rise you up, girl. Yeah, it was never, do these things because you’re being bullied or bad or you know like no no no, it was just all about the you’re gonna love this next question. Let’s hear it. I can’t wait.

Samantha Pruitt: 42:19

And we use this term quite a bit in coaching a thought partner. Will this thought partner bring out more of my potential than I would access or could access on my own? That is all about the curated space that is created for the human to do their work. That space is critical to all of this actually even being able to occur. Right, it’s like the seed goes into the soil. You water this, all of those things it’s like. What is the garden that this plant is trying to bloom inside of? What does this look like?

Polly Mertens: 43:04

And I think you know when we were talking about. You know good fit. Is this the person and stuff. A couple things occur to me. One is, you know I can remember a relationship I had with a coachee and, and how I look at it is every person who comes to me is a snowflake, right? And the questions that I’ll have with this person and the meetings and how they’ll go and the things in the tone of voice even that I’ll use, it’s always different right.

Polly Mertens: 43:30

And I think that that’s the beauty of when the relationship is a healthy, one is working with that person, right. And so, like, I had this one coaching client who was like in a W-2 job, wanting to, like, show, you know, shine her magic. She was wanting to start like a comedy store and bring comedy to the community and all this stuff. And we’re going over her financials because she did, you know, we did like the business stuff. Like here’s my financial projections. I remember sitting there and she’s sitting there with this, not cushy, but you know, w2 job and she’s getting this little paycheck and she’s like, oh, should I, shouldn’t I? And in that moment I was like, girl, I believe in you so much, right. So, like, I poured my belief into her. She did that. She was like, oh, you know, like she ran off and I just that’s what I just shared, what was real for in that moment, right. And she did that. Like our community has the community I live in now has had that for however many years she’s been doing that, and the people that she’s transformed because of the work that she’s done, it’s amazing, right, because she, in that moment she didn’t have enough belief.

Polly Mertens: 44:30

And that’s sometimes what coaches do. Is they? You lean on their belief right. And there’ll be other times where I’m coaching people and I’m hard on them and I’m like you got to get your work done right. Like like you got to push on them a little bit but in the with love, like that coach pushed on me in the volleyball training was like you got to do your reps, you got to do that. You know that’s that right. And so sometimes I got to like push on a client more, not just feed them with belief in them, but like do your damn pushups, brother.

Polly Mertens: 45:02

You know, as I got this client right now he’s just running around I’m like I need to know your burn rate, like I need you to like you need to know your burn rate Right, and I’m like on him, like get your burn rate, like figure that out and learn about this. And you know sometimes it’s. But it’s those relationships where you feel like what you need, in that moment you’re getting whatever it is.

Samantha Pruitt: 45:22

Exactly and being able to move fluidly from these different ways of coaching the very same individual? Oh, yeah, right, because their life is changing and evolving before your eyes and, if they are doing the work, they are becoming literally a different person on the daily, and so your coaching should change with them on the journey.

Polly Mertens: 45:48

Right? Well, and it’s you know from the, you know the person listening to this perspective it’s like are you? You know, sometimes you need in the beginning a lot of help with the vision, right, you need some big picture thinking, right? Or?

Polly Mertens: 45:59

maybe you need roadmaps, stuff like that. And then you need some accountability and some cheerleading, right. And then there’s dark moments when things aren’t going well and you need that like pick me up, right. And then sometimes you’re getting a little aloof or you’re getting lazy and they’re like, hey, hey, hey, let’s scale it back, let’s come back to what you know. What are we doing here, right? You know, and sometimes it’s purely like from the heart what does this person, this person just needs to talk some stuff out, Right?

Polly Mertens: 46:23

So, feeling that you have the per and you know you and I are talking from how we coach. So you know, god bless anybody listening to this, not every relationship that you get with a coach. You’re looking for all of this. So I respect the spectrum of coaching styles and coaching relationships and stuff. I think why we wanted to do this is we want people to know you can break up with your coach. You’re absolutely empowered to do so, and that’s you being in integrity with yourself. Is like this isn’t working for me. I’m a no for this, or maybe what? Can I make this more workable? And, if not, peace out.

Samantha Pruitt: 47:02

What was so cool about this conversation as we come to a close is, I think, what we brought out into the light. If you will, will have the individual listening who is either looking for a coach, has a coach, whatever. Maybe they need to just get clear with themselves. Maybe they thought they wanted a certain thing, but they want something completely different, and that’s totally cool and amazing. I love it when my clients come to me and they’re like so we did that thing and you know, I’m like I’m good now I’m good, I’m talking to me about that thing. I want to totally course correct and pivot into this other thing.

Polly Mertens: 47:38

Yeah, let’s start talking about that, or they don’t you know my, I love working myself out of a job.

Samantha Pruitt: 47:44

Or there’s that.

Polly Mertens: 47:44

Exactly, I’m like I. You know you talk, you might be better at that than me. Well, no, I’m a hundred percent, because one of the things that I got as part of my learning through the hypnotherapy practice is and working with Tony Robbins is, you know, he has a whole movie like I, I’m not your guru, kind of thing, right, and what he found is when he started helping and coaching people, let’s say, to quit smoking or, you know, get some results in their life or whatever, he would pretty much, like you know, hypnotize them to believing you know, I don’t need smoking, you know whatever. And then when it would kind of wear off, you know, they get to some other. They’d, like you know, get off it and they’d have to come back to him and he’s like these people need to be self-coaching, like, like teaching to fish, teaching to self.

Polly Mertens: 48:33

You know what do you need? Because I think the stronger the person is in knowing who they are asking themselves these questions. I mean you and I will get coaching at times, but the amount of self-coaching we do with ourselves, that’s all day long, all day long. That’s how we do it, right? So not to say that you always need a coach too, right, like it’s totally like. The goal is not for you to like lock into coaching and need coaching forever. I mean, some people love therapy for the rest of their life. Maybe there’s some things you need to work out, you know, or maybe there’s a faster track to that.

Samantha Pruitt: 49:07

But when you don’t need it, part way like it’s okay. Yeah, Because ideally you develop those muscles and now you can go on your journey, self-coaching, and you can come back to it when you need to or not, or you can use those skills and those muscles you and I are great about doing this with each other and just be like ping, ping, ping, bounce stuff off and be like got it, I knew. Thank you for hearing me and bearing witness to me finding the solution myself.

Polly Mertens: 49:28

Yeah, yeah, and sometimes you need that thought, you need that heavy thought partner. So, whatever it looks like, so let’s wrap it up what’s the one thing you got? A one thing for people. Maybe it’s one of your questions.

Samantha Pruitt: 49:45

What do you have for right to the end? Okay, absolutely. The one thing this week is that people have choices and they are empowered to make this decision themselves. They don’t need anyone’s permission. If it is time to break up with your coach, then it is time to break up with your coach. So, really, the take home is be empowered, right? Ask yourself these questions, have this conversation with yourself internally, have it outwardly with your coach if you need to, if it’s appropriate, and then make a decision, because this is your one precious life. All right, lady, let’s wrap this party up?

Polly Mertens: 50:17

Yeah, make that decision Sounds good. What do you want them to remember today, as we always remind our beautiful humans?

Samantha Pruitt: 50:25

how your messy life looks is not as important as how it feels. And you.

Polly Mertens: 50:35

Oh yeah, and every day is your opportunity. You’re awesome.

Samantha Pruitt: 50:39

All right, thanks, fans, see you later. Thanks, polly.